| Max 2011: The word on the street.. |
 soontekk |
As usual, global quietness and lots and lots of non-information around about Max2011.
Will Adsk fix its errors, please its crowd or will it milk the final drops from a product that once seemed to go places and is now unfortunately being overtaken by cheaper or free software while subscription users weap and hurt small animals.
So.. what's the word on the street ?
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12/20/2009 1:24:54 PM (last edit: 12/20/2009 1:24:54 PM)
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| TimTamFin |
Don't know if you've already read Ken Pimental's blog regarding the development of 3dsmax. In case you haven't. He said that there won't be a re-write and basically nothing changes except the way we use max. So yes ... I'm moving out of max.
I'm currently using Lightwave 9.6 side-by-side with max ... brushing up my skills. Thinking about updating to Core. Also Blender is on the list, so probably mix of Blender and Lightwave.
Rgds,
Timo
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12/20/2009 1:45:36 PM (last edit: 12/20/2009 1:51:15 PM)
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| advance-software |
2011 will be the best release in a long time if Autodesk get the feedback they need to address issues of concern to the community. This means providing clear, prioritized concerns, with justification for why an issue should be addressed ahead of others. Clearly this is subjective as different things concern different groups. You can affect this process. They are listening.
I started a wiki to form a document containing a list of issues. No-one has contributed.
http://maxforums.wikidot.com
That means you are all fine with the existing product & no changes are required. Right ?
Ad$k flames, etc. are not helpful.
I'd like to see DirectX 11 support, standard external referencing, and performance back to at least the level of pre 2009 releases.
Fixing CAT stability problems so that it is fit for use in a production environment should be addressed in a 2010 service pack or hotfix.
Integrated real-time raytracer support would be interesting.
Ken's blog : http://area.autodesk.com/blogs/ken/excalibur_xbr_notes
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12/20/2009 1:49:30 PM (last edit: 12/20/2009 4:44:09 PM)
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| reeves1984 |
Which plugins will be part of the next version, which apps will be bundled with it? Thats probably it right.
xsi woo, do it
www.simonreeves.com - freelance artist
New short film! site thread! | "Diversion"2006 | "Hitchhiker"2005
read 2410 times
12/20/2009 1:54:30 PM (last edit: 12/20/2009 1:54:30 PM)
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| MrBurns |
I have the Education Suite, which includes Max, Maya and Softimage (all 2010) :D I need to learn the latter two though, haven't spent thaaat much time with them yet.
Things I'd like to see in a new Max version:
- a better array tool (making it possible to change all sorts of attributes, not just move, rotate and scale the object)
- a node system for textures and wiring (and maybe other things)
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12/20/2009 2:28:16 PM (last edit: 12/20/2009 2:28:16 PM)
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| soontekk |
after reading the Ken P blog it seems they are (still) running around like headless chickens knowing what they should do, i only fil to believe they will pull it off or any bit of it tbh
funny they should name it excalibur lol, an uber weapon that was of no use to anyone for ages, caused a lot of frustration to those who tried and finally took one idiot that strolled by and pulled it from the dirt to everyone's surprise (and prolly because it was just stuck in a strange bendy way to start with..)
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12/20/2009 6:58:17 PM (last edit: 12/20/2009 6:58:17 PM)
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| Bolteon |
Preface: Excalibur (or XBR) is a restructuring of 3ds Max that is intended to occur over three phases (not releases) and addresses fundamental improvements in workflow, UI and performance. 3ds Max 2010 is part of Phase I and you can see elements of some of the changes in the release. Things like the visual quality of the viewport, the use of metasl, new UIs, etc. Well, that was a launching pad for XBR, but we're really only about 50 meters above the launch pad at this point and we still have a long way to go before we reach our destination. Yes, we could have built a new codebase from the ground-up, but we'd prefer to bring you all along with us on this journey instead of forcing you to "abandon ship" because we started from scratch with an application that was new and shiny but didn't quite solve any real problems for you. For a product in our position, #1 professional tool in the world, that isn't something you take lightly. So instead, we decided to approach this in three major phases. I think Bobo put it best when he said that, “you are changing the engine of the race car while it is going 100 miles an hour”, or words to that effect. Yes, this isn’t for the faint of heart, but we’re pretty confident we can pull this off, and 3ds Max 2010 helped build our confidence.
with the above being said, unless they're totally bullshittting people openly; i dont know if i can agree with the lot of you that keep thinking that max is a sinking ship.
they're logic makes total sense, a rewrite at this point would be just starting the game over with a different set of issues...
AS is right in that key issues need to be brought forward and presented to the right people but in the end what they're trying to do seems like the best approach to deliver a tool capable of carrying us into the next generation of 3D.
-Marko Mandaric
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12/21/2009 12:43:06 AM (last edit: 12/21/2009 12:43:06 AM)
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| TimTamFin |
"...and addresses fundamental improvements in workflow, UI and performance..."
How does the chancing UI help with usability and why rewrite makes me "abandon ship". No it doesn't - lack of rewrite makes me start using other software. I'm not abandoning anything. Max just won't be my main focus anymore ... I still got the license for it.
If I remember correctly Windows 7 is a rewrite. Might be wrong but I remember reading about it. Then there are 3D software like Lightwave Core (rewrite), Blender 2.5 (rewrite), Silo3D 2.0 (rewrite). Just a few examples, but it can be done. Each of those 3D software are from much smaller companies than Autodesk.
IMO setting some workers aside to create bug fixes for current 2010 version and releasing rewritten version in few years would be better alternative. Max has gotten bloated and all that they are planning to do is CPR.
Segmenting the software tasks might help a bit, but all in all the underlying problem remains. The software is not very efficient.
I believe that Autodesk has dug their own hole with subscription. The reason being ... Why would anyone pay 500 USD for bugfixes when earlier they got a brand new version with it ?... Now they've realized this and the fact that the userbase is shrinking. So the XBR is just CPR. Not a real improvement.
This is only my opinion.
Rgds,
Timo
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12/21/2009 1:40:03 AM (last edit: 12/21/2009 1:40:03 AM)
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| ChaosQuack |
I am more and more think along the lines of what you are saying Timo.
I just wish Silo would update so I know they aren't a dead company.
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12/21/2009 3:07:23 AM (last edit: 12/21/2009 3:07:23 AM)
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| reeves1984 |
Actually xsi8 is really buggy (er I mean 2010) on linux anyway.
Whatever is going with max, I cannot get over the lack of a decent pass system, its crazy compared to maya/xsi
www.simonreeves.com - freelance artist
New short film! site thread! | "Diversion"2006 | "Hitchhiker"2005
read 2232 times
12/21/2009 5:31:59 AM (last edit: 12/21/2009 5:31:59 AM)
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| soontekk |
They have been saying max needs a rewrite for ages
Instead of actually setting up a team that would actually build a new core paralel to regular development they just went on milking it for another decade only to realize it has gone too far and there is no way back.
Max has been a cashcow for adsk and they used the cash to consume all the other cool software that had some real features and development which has now also grinded to a halt.
Now that it is becoming obvious that free apps are becoming better and people are finally dropping their subscriptions (AND THEY SHOULD) or their software as a whole, they start to get a bit worried... so now, instead of just saying they should do something about it, they also made.. yes.. some slides... that got leaked ... yeah..
ad$k deserves a lesson, i hope they get one..
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12/21/2009 8:47:07 AM (last edit: 12/21/2009 8:47:07 AM)
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| HappyDude2 |
I haven't used MAX since ver 4 :)
Did they ever get Boolean's to work probably?
I'm not meaning a workaround, but actually work properly, despite your initial mesh cage.
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12/21/2009 9:19:22 AM (last edit: 12/21/2009 9:19:22 AM)
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| soontekk |
they bought proboolean and put it next to the old boolean
if one doesn't work the other probably will.. can u believe it..
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12/21/2009 9:33:44 AM (last edit: 12/21/2009 9:33:44 AM)
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| advance-software |
The max core doesn't need a re-write. It's fundamentally sound. You evolve sub-systems as necessary to introduce new functionality.
It would be sensible to migrate the user interface from Windows native to a cross platform windowing system to enable porting to other operating systems and processor architectures. This is a non-trivial task, but it could be done.
There are a number of legacy systems that could be retired to simplify - numerous ways of achieving the same thing is confusing. This could be done incrementally by taking old systems off the primary user interface, but keeping them available for legacy support. Over time, they could be phased out.
Once performance is back up to scratch, max might get looked on in a more positive light again. This can't happen soon enough.
That said, Blender is clearly a game changer and it will be interesting to see how things develop.
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12/21/2009 10:22:06 AM (last edit: 12/21/2009 11:23:27 AM)
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| Bolteon |
AS....
i hate to say this but the more i read what you write the less i hate your soul.
read up people, words from a real world software developer; not the 99% of you just rambling what you think should be done. try and think about it.
-Marko Mandaric
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. : m a r k o m a n d a r i c : .
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read 2086 times
12/21/2009 12:29:18 PM (last edit: 12/21/2009 12:29:18 PM)
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